karting and sliding just seem wrong.

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gizmo
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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby gizmo » Mon Jan 11, 2010 4:34 pm

ra64t wrote:2:47 doesn't look like much of a slide to me. Looks like he was being cautious of the guy behind sticking his nose in. The other laps he is not sliding there at all.
the esses I ignore because that's just how the kart goes through that turn. you can't get through it quickly without getting a bit squirly.
ra64t wrote:The main places he is sliding is that hairpin (around 2:50) and the fast ess/chicane (around 3:06), his technique here looks reasonable to me.
in that corkscrew, he's definitely hitting the brakes with the wheel turned left, and it's causing his kart to dramatically rotate left around its center. it might not seem like it from his point of view, but being behind gues who have done it, it looks as if they're about to slide sideways into a barrier but instead they round the turn.
ra64t wrote:Certainly it's good to try different technique and find what's best suitable for you, but if your technique isn't really working you you might want to try something else.
agreed, but i've been avoiding that technique because it only applies to karts and i don't see myself becoming a race car driver in nascar through karts. but i think there is a hybrid maneuver, i just know it.
ra64t wrote:One think I don't know if you are considering is the potential grip difference around the middle vs. the far outside edge, which could be why those guys aren't using that section of track. With the normal indoor tire compounds and the slick(shiny) surfaces, off line is usually dusty and very slick. If they have unlimited membership and have turned thousands of laps, and know what they are doing, you'd think they'd have figured out where the grip on the track is.
this track is actually asphalt, it's not like the other crap place i went to where it's slick. there's tons of grip on that asphalt, even if it looks a bit shiny, it's not, it's about as tacky as e-town.

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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby ra64t » Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:13 pm

he could well be using the brake to help rotate, although it is possible to do it with just lift of and quick turn in. Either way I agree he is certainly sliding at a decent slip angle, but not so much that it is completely killing his momentum.

Even if the track is normal asphalt, the tires probably still don't provide super grip (I'm pretty confident of this by watching the video) and regardless the points about grip on line vs. off could still apply.
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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby gizmo » Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:41 pm

well, unfortunately for me, tonight they are not offering arrive and drive on the two tracks in the competition. they're offering a half track arrive and drive, i plan to use it to try different techniques through the tighter turns. i wonder what i'll learn, if anything, without some instrument constantly measuring my "progress".

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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby Bawked » Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:09 am

the karter in the close racing at GPNY is quite nice, needs to sort out the corner before that white patch though.

I kart a bit, and on the track i race on theres a patch where you can drift 20 odd meters and it is the quickest way to get around the corner. Mostly grip is the best way to go, but when you need the kart to rotate quicker you need to get the kart loose. kinda feels like driving the mr2, with the rear engine and all... need to load the front wheels and braking shifts alot of weight. going sideways down the straights out of corners is too much fun tho, so i mix speed with pleasure :mrgreen:
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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby gizmo » Fri Jan 15, 2010 2:29 am

I can no longer deny the viability of sliding. I had a quick chat with the track Marshall, he suggested that I lift off long before the corner and flick the wheel then opposite lock. He warned that use of the brakes would cause a 180. I created a hybrid, threshold, then flick, tap brakes if rotation incomplete, then immediate gas. What a difference.

However, I got there on a busy night. Earliest available race required an hour wait. I started in last, moving through lapped traffic the entire race. I know sliding will allow me to get into the bracket I want but I need an open track to qualify. I moved from 10th to 2nd in each race, cleanly, through fairly thick traffic. Traffic that had little problem wrecking, running offline, and everything else imaginable; they were just people looking to have fun, not set records, but despite that I had the best time ever in A kArt because I was flying through traffic, often getting held up by wrecks in front of me. I even saw Russ wheler put Cole trickle in the wall, laughed my ass off when I saw that one. I did have one free lap to myself, one chAnce at the dream car but I over rotated the slide and botched the turn. -- something that would've been avoided with more than one chance to run on the envelope.

I hope to go back once more before month end, despite serious debt, to see if in open air I run the times I figure.

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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby ra64t » Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:11 am

nice. yeah you need more then one clean lap to set a good time. lots of slow traffic can be fun but is not conductive to good lap times. also remember there is variance in the performance of different karts so the more you go the bigger your advantage of hitting the ideal scenario of ideal kart in ideal conditions. I figure a typical variance can be over 1 sec. which could easily put you in or out of the top 15.
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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby Damus » Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:58 pm

That looks like a really nice track. There's a karting place 30-40 mins from where I live that I go to from time to time but it isn't nice like that one. It's completely flat. Anyhow, they have a league that I've been thinking about joining. I'm three seconds off the quickest times, though I don't go everyday, either.
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Re: karting and sliding just seem wrong.

Postby Bawked » Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:55 pm

That track is nice, i doubt there is one that good anywhere near where i live.
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