Gas on clutch release during upshift

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MidnightInGotham
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Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby MidnightInGotham » Mon Aug 08, 2016 1:10 pm

I've gotten a ton of great advice on here thus far and I want to say thank you to everyone!

I have a 2016 GTI 6MT; new Vw's have lots of rev hang between gears (except with the a/c on but that's another deal). Anyway, the 1>2 shift is one where you almost have to give it 1+ seconds until the clutch is released otherwise you can feel the engine rock on the mounts. You also have to give it a bit of a delay in 2>3 and 3>4. To get properly smooth shifts but this can also be somewhat slow.

I usually get off the clutch all the way and then apply some gas, during casual driving. Yesterday I tried applying a tiny amount of gas (slightly depress the gas, nothing great) towards the end of the clutch release and I noticed that this smoothed out the shifts including the 1>2. I was surprised that this smoothed out the shift since typically the revs hang too much and if I shift too quickly I feel acceleration upon clutch release as it brings the revs down).

My question is which is the 'proper' way of driving and does applying gas make sense that it would smooth the shift for a car with some hang and does this create additional or unnecessary clutch wear?

Please let me know if I should clarify anything. Thanks again!
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby tankinbeans » Mon Aug 08, 2016 1:13 pm

Applying a bit of throttle at the end of your clutch action seems right to me. My car does it automatically during gear changes.
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby theholycow » Mon Aug 08, 2016 1:55 pm

A little bit of accelerator pedal action might cancel rev hang, which could definitely make it easier to shift smoothly.
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby MidnightInGotham » Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:04 pm

tankinbeans wrote:Applying a bit of throttle at the end of your clutch action seems right to me. My car does it automatically during gear changes.

ST does that automatically? That's awesome!
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MidnightInGotham
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby MidnightInGotham » Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:07 pm

theholycow wrote:A little bit of accelerator pedal action might cancel rev hang, which could definitely make it easier to shift smoothly.


I could see that. I'll keep trying it, but does it cause more clutch wear than my other method?
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby theholycow » Mon Aug 08, 2016 10:32 pm

MidnightInGotham wrote:I could see that. I'll keep trying it, but does it cause more clutch wear than my other method?

Based on what you describe, it sounds like it probably does not.

Anyway, it's fine either way...really, don't worry about innocent stuff like that where you're not deliberately abusing it.
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby MidnightInGotham » Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:19 pm

theholycow wrote:
MidnightInGotham wrote:I could see that. I'll keep trying it, but does it cause more clutch wear than my other method?

Based on what you describe, it sounds like it probably does not.

Anyway, it's fine either way...really, don't worry about innocent stuff like that where you're not deliberately abusing it.


Well I want to learn good and correct techniques while I'm still early on here. Do you fully disengage your clutch prior to applying throttle?
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby theholycow » Tue Aug 09, 2016 3:36 pm

MidnightInGotham wrote:Do you fully disengage your clutch prior to applying throttle?

Please clarify, and please confirm that your terminology is correct. Your question leaves me unsure.

Engage the clutch: Remove foot from clutch pedal, allowing the clutch to engage and transmit power.
Disengage the clutch: Step on the clutch pedal down to the floor, freeing the clutch to spin without connecting the engine to the transmission/wheels/road.

During most upshifts in reasonably-behaved cars I begin to step on the accelerator pedal long before I finish operating the clutch pedal, in fact, just before the clutch even begins to grab. If I don't then the engine RPM will be lower than needed, causing the clutch to have to do the work of spinning up the engine and dragging down the car's road speed. Way back in the beforetime, when computers didn't meddle with the driver's throttle operation, the driver was always expected to do this, but it has become somewhat less common with rev hang and other meddlesome computer behavior.

Looking at it from the other side of the equation: If you watch the tachometer as your left foot comes up and the tachometer does something (jumping either up or down) then it would be better (for smoothness and for clutch wear) to do that a moment sooner by manipulating the accelerator pedal if possible.
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby MidnightInGotham » Tue Aug 09, 2016 4:14 pm

theholycow wrote:
MidnightInGotham wrote:Do you fully disengage your clutch prior to applying throttle?

Please clarify, and please confirm that your terminology is correct. Your question leaves me unsure.

Engage the clutch: Remove foot from clutch pedal, allowing the clutch to engage and transmit power.
Disengage the clutch: Step on the clutch pedal down to the floor, freeing the clutch to spin without connecting the engine to the transmission/wheels/road.

Looking at it from the other side of the equation: If you watch the tachometer as your left foot comes up and the tachometer does something (jumping either up or down) then it would be better (for smoothness and for clutch wear) to do that a moment sooner by manipulating the accelerator pedal if possible.


You're right, I meant engage the clutch when removing my foot from the peddle. Sorry for the confusion.

Also from your last comment, if I engage the clutch too soon, the revs will jump down, sometimes somewhat drastically which I assume means the engine speed exceeds the wheels speed, correct? If that's the case I wouldn't want to use throttle as that would increase the deficit.

If I shift too slowly, then the revs jump up which I assume means the whee speed exceeds the engine speed and In this case, throttle would be beneficial.

Am I correct in my thinking there?
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Re: Gas on clutch release during upshift

Postby theholycow » Tue Aug 09, 2016 6:45 pm

Yes, your thinking is correct in both scenarios...with the possible exception of a computer that decides to cancel rev hang on accelerator input, in which case stepping on the go-pedal a little might actually allow you to bring engine speed down. I don't know if any are programmed that way, but the idea came up earlier in this thread.
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