Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

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Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby Rope-Pusher » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:13 pm

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CONTINENTAL PUTS THE BRAKES ON EVs - from Autoline Daily
And speaking of unique concepts, Continental developed a creative wheel and brake assembly meant for electric vehicles. The New Wheel Concept, as it’s called, consists of several parts, an aluminum star and small caliper that bolt directly to the axle hub and an outer rim and large aluminum brake rotor that bolt to the star. As you can see, rather than clamping onto the outside of the rotor, the caliper clamps on the inside. And due to the large size of the rotor, much less clamping force is need to provide a high level of braking, which is why the caliper is so small. And because it’s aluminum, it doesn’t wear or corrode like a steel rotor and dissipates heat much faster. Continental says the rotor could last the lifetime of the vehicle. Other benefits include easy to change brake pads, lighter overall weight and quieter braking because most of the force is sent into the axle hub.

https://www.continental-corporation.com ... cles-92514
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby theholycow » Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:59 am

Interesting design. I think I like it.

However, I'm not so sure that this part sounds accurate: "Continental assumes, after the results of the initial practical tests, that the Al disk itself is not subject to wear, unlike cast-iron disks. With the New Wheel Concept, abrasion only takes place on the pads". Riiiight...just keep telling yourself that.
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby Rope-Pusher » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:34 am

Cow-Man,
Go to Frankfurt and ask them that same question.
While you are there, say "HI!" to the Frankfurters for me, OK?

I've heard that on some hybrids, corrosion of the brake components is an issue because they can use the retearding forces from regereration for much of their braking needs. Think of it as a vehicle that gets parked for a week or two and you are always scrubbing corrosion off the rotors when you drive it. Unfortunately, I've also heard that they aren't exercising the calipers enough to keep them from getting stuck by corrosion as well. Continental didn't mention if their concept took steps to combat this corrosion as well. Back in the day, Corvette drivers might tend to take them out only for pleasure rides when the weather was nice and they had caliper corrosion problems as well. Seems to me their fix was to go to Silicone brake fluid and stainless-steel calipers. The Army went with Silicone brake fluid a number of years back because of their tendency to store vehicles and then expect them to work properly on a moment's notice. DOT 3 and 4 brake fluids are hydrophilic, while Silicone brake fluid is snot.
Last edited by Rope-Pusher on Sat Aug 12, 2017 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby Rope-Pusher » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:43 am

Speakin of brake rotor corrosion, this is a big deal with new vehicles that sit for a long time during shipping or storage.

Feritic-nitro carburizing is a fairly common process that vehicle manufacturers use to combat this problem.

The GM-developed process is ferritic-nitro carburizing (FNC), a form of case hardening. FNC is a gaseous process that “diffuses nitrogen and carbon into the metallic part” following production machining of the rotor's friction surface, explained Jim Webster, a GM brake engineer who helped spearhead the program.

The rotors are super-heated at 560°C (1040°F) for up to 24 hours within a nitrogen-rich atmosphere. The nitrogen atoms bond to the surface of the steel rotor, hardening it and increasing its strength.

The FNC process lays down a 10-µm-thick transfer layer across the entire rotor surface, including the center “hat” section and inside the central cooling vanes of ventilated rotors. (Ten microns is roughly 1/10 the width of a human hair.) The resulting friction surface is significantly more durable than that of a rotor without the FNC treatment, while remaining virtually impervious to corrosion and rust.

“We expect FNC will double rotor life from the current 40,000 miles, to 80,000 miles, before it needs to be ‘turned’ [machined to regain factory-spec lateral runout and surface finish],” Webster said. Other benefits include reduced brake dust accumulation on the road wheels and smoother brake-pedal feel over time.
http://articles.sae.org/10472/
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby theholycow » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:09 pm

Rope-Pusher wrote:I've heard that on some hybrids, corrosion of the brake components

Blame it on the short attention span of mooers. While reading the article I kept forgetting and remembering that it was specifically in the context of hybrids, and when I posted that I totally forgot. I bet conscientious economy-minded hybrid drivers manage to avoid using friction brakes a whole lot.

I still disagree that it would "not be subject to wear", but I can see its wear life in that application for some drivers being so long that it effectively needn't be thought of as a wear part - kinda like synchronizers.
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby theholycow » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:16 pm

Rope-Pusher wrote:The GM-developed process is ferritic-nitro carburizing (FNC), a form of case hardening.

Oh man, I want that. I'd love for the vent vanes and the hat to be rust-free, even if the nitrogen-rich layer wore off of the friction surface rather than lasting until the rotor is turned. (If it actually does last then the rotor won't need to be turned anyway...for part of that 10 µm thick layer to remain, we're talking effectively zero wear.)

Too bad they can't make it rainbowy since it's a form of case hardening...
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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby potownrob » Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:11 am

eye like pizza
BUT DEM FAHGLEITZ!! :shock:

For Pizza!!!!

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Re: Wadda You Think I Am...Sum Kinda Brembo?

Postby Rope-Pusher » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:19 am

potownrob wrote:eye like pizza

Me too! Too bad the clear-coat broke down and they got scummy-looking after a few years.
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