Infant Gratification?
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Infant Gratification?
Why Americans reject build-to-order cars
It is inherently more expensive for an automaker and their dealerships to sell vehicles from sales lot inventory compared to selling vehicles built after a customer submits an order. In Europe, 50% of sales are for "Build to order" versus fewer than 5% in the USA. Outliers in the US market occur where passion rules the purchase decision.
http://www.autonews.com/article/2016060 ... order-cars
It is inherently more expensive for an automaker and their dealerships to sell vehicles from sales lot inventory compared to selling vehicles built after a customer submits an order. In Europe, 50% of sales are for "Build to order" versus fewer than 5% in the USA. Outliers in the US market occur where passion rules the purchase decision.
http://www.autonews.com/article/2016060 ... order-cars
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Re: Infant Gratification?
What is this, bizzarro world? Opposite day? What am I missing here?
I remember when I was a child my parents almost always ordered their cars with the exact options they wanted. I'd watch as they went through a very long checklist of options with the salesman.
Then as time went on, dealers were less and less willing to order cars, and options were less and less available a-la-carte so there was less reason to bother trying to convince the salesman to order. There were a few option "packages" with a bunch of crap you don't want and the one thing you do want, and you could take it all or leave it all. There was nothing to gain by ordering, the dealers/salesmen balked at the idea, and they wouldn't budge on the MSRP if you ordered but they'd cut you a deal if you bought from dealer inventory.
I remember when I was a child my parents almost always ordered their cars with the exact options they wanted. I'd watch as they went through a very long checklist of options with the salesman.
Then as time went on, dealers were less and less willing to order cars, and options were less and less available a-la-carte so there was less reason to bother trying to convince the salesman to order. There were a few option "packages" with a bunch of crap you don't want and the one thing you do want, and you could take it all or leave it all. There was nothing to gain by ordering, the dealers/salesmen balked at the idea, and they wouldn't budge on the MSRP if you ordered but they'd cut you a deal if you bought from dealer inventory.
...so, like, maybe they could make it possible to order something different than what's on the lot, actually allow you to order, and pass all those alleged savings on to you for ordering instead of buying from "costly, cumbersome" inventory that the dealer wants gone.Not that some U.S. carmakers haven't been struck by the same thing. Over the years, they frequently have studied what it would take to wean American consumers off decades of buying off the lot.
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watkins wrote:Humans have rear-biased AWD. Cows have 4WD
Re: Infant Gratification?
The salesman being commission driven want you to buy whatever they have on the lot so they can get their money now and not give you a chance to cancel their order. You want a manual and you will probably have to order one that is only available on the most stripped down model with the smallest motor.
Bill Berckman
West Chester, Ohio
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West Chester, Ohio
2007 Honda Element EX AWD 5 Speed MT
- potownrob
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Re: Infant Gratification?
I probably don't have to tell you guys, but I can get impatient with having to wait to get a new car. I had to wait 1-2 weeks for my accord to arrive (didn't order it but had to wait for it to arrive) and that felt like an eternity. I have found other than in that case that the dealers really want to sell what they have on the lot. Suggestions about ordering a car or having them trade for one are often scoffed at or ignored. With the new VW they were big on selling what they had. Questions about lighting packages and such were like asking them if they knew where hitler's secret treasure was hidden. The upside is that, despite no extra incentives on the Various golf models, they were willing to go well under invoice on the pricing. Getting them down on price at the end of the month and then getting them to come close on the next trim level went much better than expected. I still have to pick up some hours to cover my now higher payment, but I have a nicer car too. Now just need to save money for that APR tune
ClutchFork wrote:...So I started carrying a stick of firewood with me and that became my parking brake.
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Re: Infant Gratification?
It's a trade-off. Limiting option combinations reduces manufacturing cost (in unique wiring harnesses, trim panels, and logistics) and floor-plan costs (less reason to dealer swap or wait for special order). Full customization would sell more total cars.
For exactly what I want I'd wait longer than any of the options. I'd demand a better price to buy off the rack.
For exactly what I want I'd wait longer than any of the options. I'd demand a better price to buy off the rack.
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Re: Infant Gratification?
It really depends on the options and if they're offered singly. An upgraded radio, a sunroof, and heated seats are what I would look for (unstated is the requirement that it is an actual color). Otherwise, I'll take what's in stock.
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Re: Infant Gratification?
Tummy, the customers power to get a bette bargain is that if the price is right, he will buy right now, from inventory that the dealer is paying bank loans on and in time to meet this month's sales quota. Even if it would cost the company and the dealership less money if the customer ordered the car he wants, I don't think the dealer has as much incentive to give the customer a deal he can't walk away from compared to when the customer is purchasing a vehicle from inventory.
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- ClutchFork
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Re: Infant Gratification?
The only build-to-order car I would be willing to wait for is something like a '69 Road Runner, and the great part is you can get one of those built to order today if you have enough money.
Stick shiftin since '77
theholycow wrote:Why in the world would you even want to be as smooth as an automatic? Might as well just drive an automatic...
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Re: Infant Gratification?
In day of old, when knights were bold, and rubbers weren't invented,.....
...dealerships were located along small town main streets and there was no room for big car lots. I've seen some with rooftop parking to get around space limitations. When dealerships moved to the outlying areas, they had enough room to carry a lot more inventory.
...dealerships were located along small town main streets and there was no room for big car lots. I've seen some with rooftop parking to get around space limitations. When dealerships moved to the outlying areas, they had enough room to carry a lot more inventory.
'08 Jeep Liberty 6-Speed MT - "Last of the Mohicans"
Re: Infant Gratification?
Just wanted to weigh in on this but after some time...
As far as I'm concerned build-to-order cars is the only way I'm going for myself personally if I want to: A) Buy a new car, period... B) Buy a car with a manual transmission around here. People buying/leasing/financing brand new cars should be GETTING what they want to a tee with 0 compromises. You're paying a premium to do so. Never really made much sense to me in the sense of buying a new vehicle and feeling that you had to make compromises or subtract things. Also, you don't know the life of the cars on the lot with those weird amount of miles on it like 70-100 "brand new". For example, I test drove a Focus ST and the sales guy openly admitted the car was getting hooned left and right by "amateurs". It had already 110 miles on it by the time I was test driving it and then they felt the need to make an attractive offer to that particular car. I really liked the car honestly, but unless they provided 50% off of the MSRP there was no chance in hell I was purchasing that one.
In another instance, even models and the ones I was looking at that have above average manual transmission take rates are still difficult to find on the lots. Talking along the lines of Subaru WRX, VW GTI, and Mazda 3. Can't say it about the Focus ST because that's manual only... but I could not find a VW GTI with a stick that wasn't in transit and already sold. Subaru was essentially the same but they went one step further and pretty much told me flat out they can't let me test drive unless I signed a waiver and negotiated a price (multiple dealerships), and Mazda 3 the only manuals I could find were on like lowly base models with the 2.0L (I wanted the 2.5L). So to me build to order cars is pretty much me being at their mercy... because I'm not willing to compromise and because it's really the only route provided.
As far as I'm concerned build-to-order cars is the only way I'm going for myself personally if I want to: A) Buy a new car, period... B) Buy a car with a manual transmission around here. People buying/leasing/financing brand new cars should be GETTING what they want to a tee with 0 compromises. You're paying a premium to do so. Never really made much sense to me in the sense of buying a new vehicle and feeling that you had to make compromises or subtract things. Also, you don't know the life of the cars on the lot with those weird amount of miles on it like 70-100 "brand new". For example, I test drove a Focus ST and the sales guy openly admitted the car was getting hooned left and right by "amateurs". It had already 110 miles on it by the time I was test driving it and then they felt the need to make an attractive offer to that particular car. I really liked the car honestly, but unless they provided 50% off of the MSRP there was no chance in hell I was purchasing that one.
In another instance, even models and the ones I was looking at that have above average manual transmission take rates are still difficult to find on the lots. Talking along the lines of Subaru WRX, VW GTI, and Mazda 3. Can't say it about the Focus ST because that's manual only... but I could not find a VW GTI with a stick that wasn't in transit and already sold. Subaru was essentially the same but they went one step further and pretty much told me flat out they can't let me test drive unless I signed a waiver and negotiated a price (multiple dealerships), and Mazda 3 the only manuals I could find were on like lowly base models with the 2.0L (I wanted the 2.5L). So to me build to order cars is pretty much me being at their mercy... because I'm not willing to compromise and because it's really the only route provided.
- potownrob
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Re: Infant Gratification?
is this why your payments are over $600??Teamwork wrote:Just wanted to weigh in on this but after some time...
As far as I'm concerned build-to-order cars is the only way I'm going for myself personally if I want to: A) Buy a new car, period... B) Buy a car with a manual transmission around here. People buying/leasing/financing brand new cars should be GETTING what they want to a tee with 0 compromises. You're paying a premium to do so. Never really made much sense to me in the sense of buying a new vehicle and feeling that you had to make compromises or subtract things. Also, you don't know the life of the cars on the lot with those weird amount of miles on it like 70-100 "brand new". For example, I test drove a Focus ST and the sales guy openly admitted the car was getting hooned left and right by "amateurs". It had already 110 miles on it by the time I was test driving it and then they felt the need to make an attractive offer to that particular car. I really liked the car honestly, but unless they provided 50% off of the MSRP there was no chance in hell I was purchasing that one.
yeah, it's bad down there near the city. up here, the manuals are easier to find. the people of the vortex always suggest doing a nationwide search for the car you want and taking it from there. i personally settled for a car on the lot, after much haggling. you still haven't guessed what i have btw.In another instance, even models and the ones I was looking at that have above average manual transmission take rates are still difficult to find on the lots. Talking along the lines of Subaru WRX, VW GTI, and Mazda 3. Can't say it about the Focus ST because that's manual only... but I could not find a VW GTI with a stick that wasn't in transit and already sold. Subaru was essentially the same but they went one step further and pretty much told me flat out they can't let me test drive unless I signed a waiver and negotiated a price (multiple dealerships), and Mazda 3 the only manuals I could find were on like lowly base models with the 2.0L (I wanted the 2.5L). So to me build to order cars is pretty much me being at their mercy... because I'm not willing to compromise and because it's really the only route provided.
ClutchFork wrote:...So I started carrying a stick of firewood with me and that became my parking brake.
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Re: Infant Gratification?
Rob, is it a Golf Type R?
I can see you haz a blue.
I can see you haz a blue.
- potownrob
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Re: Infant Gratification?
tankinbeans wrote:Rob, is it a Golf Type R?
I can see you haz a blue.
ClutchFork wrote:...So I started carrying a stick of firewood with me and that became my parking brake.
Re: Infant Gratification?
For me? Never... My 'new' KIA lease at the time my payments were only $175 a month for a 3 year term. This car I took an outside small bank loan on a 3 year term again and my payments are only $249 and change for 36 months but I OWN this car once that's paid off. I don't really believe in lease monthly payments over $300 and for financing w/ the intention of ownership I probably wouldn't pay more then $400 a month and even that would be a stretch. My rates right now and in the past are jokingly low compared to what I paid in school loans when I was doing those.is this why your payments are over $600??
I actually was a "lucky one" that intercepted someones factory order who I guess is my doppelganger except they flubbed finding funds for the car. I wanted an S model (lowest trim level) because it had the plaid cloth, PP package (because it had an LSD), LP package (because of the HID's), and manual transmission (because I'm here ). I didn't realize in hindsight how difficult it is to obtain this until I heard pretty much everyone else had to factory order this configuration.yeah, it's bad down there near the city. up here, the manuals are easier to find. the people of the vortex always suggest doing a nationwide search for the car you want and taking it from there. i personally settled for a car on the lot, after much haggling. you still haven't guessed what i have btw
I'm guessing this is the case judging by process of elimination but I can't really see on the thumbnail avatar that well lol.Rob, is it a Golf Type R?
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Re: Infant Gratification?
I see it's a turbo.