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Just a "zzzzzz" smiley.

now i see it...wonder why it was blocked. why r u zzzing in this thread? going over stuff we've been over multiple times? sry...i brought it up

AHHHHH i'm calling cops when i get home tonight...street racesr on the way home from work...eeek!

First; to all those who say crush them, consider for one moment that all you'd be doing is encouraging the racers to flee recklessly instead of capitulating?
Second; I very strongly dislike the police, and I have good reason. That is another story, however, I think speeding tickets should help fund driving programs and track days. Maybe install a handicapper on the cars, and then with good behavior let the drivers earn back their ponies.
Lastly; All of you who sneer at people who speed and race on the street, those who like to take backroads at a brisk clip, those who can't keep off the go pedal, consider this; most of you have had the luxury of a good upbringing, school, maybe a silver spoon, or two. Some have been around race cars or tracks, or at least had access to them all their life. Tracks are expensive, there are copious rules blared through a megaphone which you cannot make out anything from, people are at a fever pitch, and for a lot of money you get very little run time. Small time events are few and far between. Often times they are member exclusive.
So, yes, street racing is bad. Speeding, carving up a sweet road, feeling torque against your back on a public road seems fine withing reason. You guys got to get off your high horse, we are all human and not moral pinnacles.
Rant over.
-Cm

I sense an uh-oh.

Cm452 wrote:First; to all those who say crush them, consider for one moment that all you'd be doing is encouraging the racers to flee recklessly instead of capitulating?
Second; I very strongly dislike the police, and I have good reason. That is another story, however, I think speeding tickets should help fund driving programs and track days. Maybe install a handicapper on the cars, and then with good behavior let the drivers earn back their ponies.
Lastly; All of you who sneer at people who speed and race on the street, those who like to take backroads at a brisk clip, those who can't keep off the go pedal, consider this; most of you have had the luxury of a good upbringing, school, maybe a silver spoon, or two. Some have been around race cars or tracks, or at least had access to them all their life. Tracks are expensive, there are copious rules blared through a megaphone which you cannot make out anything from, people are at a fever pitch, and for a lot of money you get very little run time. Small time events are few and far between. Often times they are member exclusive.
So, yes, street racing is bad. Speeding, carving up a sweet road, feeling torque against your back on a public road seems fine withing reason. You guys got to get off your high horse, we are all human and not moral pinnacles.
Rant over.
-Cm

I'm not one to sneer at speeding, until it gets to the extreme level, and I have to say I do agree a bit with your first and second point. Your third, though, seems to leave a bit of logic at the door. Consider this for a moment...why are track days so infrequent and expensive? The answer could well be street racing. Racing on the street is cheap, easy, and effective for those without deep pockets. But if those street racers would simply go to track days that are available, people will see there's money to be made, have them more often, open more race tracks, and subsequently prices will be lower.

And, some of us may have been born blessed with good education, good upbringing, regular track days, or whatever else, but I believe the rest of us just grew up and realized it's not only dangerous, but ultimately useless.

I realize racing is stupid, in fact I clearly stated it.
I'm speaking to the few who posted saying 5-0 is god, and wishing us to get caught and bend over
doing 80-85 on a 65mph highway with no one on it seems fine to me, yet if you are pulled over
Secondly, there are 35mph backroads-smooth, flat, wide. I go faster, and enjoy the curves. Once again-only in good conditions, however, some find that despicable...get over yourselves.
There was an interesting experiment with students; 50% were guards, the other inmates. The guards, made the program end abruptly-they quickly started abusing their powers.
Those infantilized by a pervasive and omnipotent government are first to call/adore 5-0 when they have a "problem", they are also the first to cede their liberties-consciously or not.
-Cm

Cm452 wrote:There was an interesting experiment with students; 50% were guards, the other inmates. The guards, made the program end abruptly-they quickly started abusing their powers.
Those infantilized by a pervasive and omnipotent government are first to call/adore 5-0 when they have a "problem", they are also the first to cede their liberties-consciously or not.
-Cm

Do you have a source for this? I'd like to know more.

I saw that study. It was really quite disturbing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

Read/heard about it and similar things in English class before.

Cm452 wrote:I realize racing is stupid, in fact I clearly stated it.
I'm speaking to the few who posted saying 5-0 is god, and wishing us to get caught and bend over
doing 80-85 on a 65mph highway with no one on it seems fine to me, yet if you are pulled over
Secondly, there are 35mph backroads-smooth, flat, wide. I go faster, and enjoy the curves. Once again-only in good conditions, however, some find that despicable...get over yourselves.
-Cm

That's all well and good, except we're not talking about a closed course here. What happens when something unexpected happens? I had two deer run out in front of me on the way to work the other day. If I'd been doing 5-10 over, I'd probably have hit them. If I'd been doubling the speed limit, it would probably have been catastrophic, totaling the truck and doing significant damage to me as well.

Some scenarios:

1) Deer run across in front of you.

2) Someone coming the other way begins to pass slower traffic, also ends up doing 10-20 over, and you crest a hill to see someone in your lane with a 160-mph closure rate.

3) Someone sitting at a stop sign on an intersecting street does everything right, but doesn't expect you to be doing 80 mph (At which speed you'll close the distance separating you in 20% less time than at 65 and you will take 50% more distance to stop) and pulls out in front of you.

4) Dirt, dust, gravel, leaves, or a damp spot left by a truck with a leaking load reduces your traction at a critical point in one of those corners you're talking about, taking you just enough off your line to have no chance of recovering.

I resent speed limits that are set ridiculously low for political or financial reasons as much as the next guy, but you can't just drive around at the limits of adhesion all the time because unexpected stuff will happen on the public roadways, and you need some maneuvering margin to adapt to unexpected situations. The faster you go, the less margin you have, and the more different your speed from what other drivers and pedestrians expect, the more likely they are to do something that will create an emergency situation for you.

Cm452 wrote:There was an interesting experiment with students; 50% were guards, the other inmates. The guards, made the program end abruptly-they quickly started abusing their powers.
Those infantilized by a pervasive and omnipotent government are first to call/adore 5-0 when they have a "problem", they are also the first to cede their liberties-consciously or not.
-Cm

Students are idiots. Well, a bit harsh. They haven't learned yet, that's why they're learning. They're the absolute worst target group for this type of experiment. Little to no real world experience, and they had no training to become guards. (Or inmates, for that matter.)

Now, if you want to run a real experiment about this, take 12 of the most ruthless criminals alive, and make those 12 guards keep them in line. See how many 'abuse' their powers then.

Big deal if they are students. There are lots of student-aged people in the world, and they often are the ones getting into trouble and /or causing trouble.

IMBoring25 wrote:

Cm452 wrote:I realize racing is stupid, in fact I clearly stated it.
I'm speaking to the few who posted saying 5-0 is god, and wishing us to get caught and bend over
doing 80-85 on a 65mph highway with no one on it seems fine to me, yet if you are pulled over
Secondly, there are 35mph backroads-smooth, flat, wide. I go faster, and enjoy the curves. Once again-only in good conditions, however, some find that despicable...get over yourselves.
-Cm

That's all well and good, except we're not talking about a closed course here. What happens when something unexpected happens? I had two deer run out in front of me on the way to work the other day. If I'd been doing 5-10 over, I'd probably have hit them. If I'd been doubling the speed limit, it would probably have been catastrophic, totaling the truck and doing significant damage to me as well.

Some scenarios:

1) Deer run across in front of you.

2) Someone coming the other way begins to pass slower traffic, also ends up doing 10-20 over, and you crest a hill to see someone in your lane with a 160-mph closure rate.

3) Someone sitting at a stop sign on an intersecting street does everything right, but doesn't expect you to be doing 80 mph (At which speed you'll close the distance separating you in 20% less time than at 65 and you will take 50% more distance to stop) and pulls out in front of you.

4) Dirt, dust, gravel, leaves, or a damp spot left by a truck with a leaking load reduces your traction at a critical point in one of those corners you're talking about, taking you just enough off your line to have no chance of recovering.

I resent speed limits that are set ridiculously low for political or financial reasons as much as the next guy, but you can't just drive around at the limits of adhesion all the time because unexpected stuff will happen on the public roadways, and you need some maneuvering margin to adapt to unexpected situations. The faster you go, the less margin you have, and the more different your speed from what other drivers and pedestrians expect, the more likely they are to do something that will create an emergency situation for you.

1) Yes, deer are a problem.

2) I never drive anything past 5 over the limit on roads I dont know, for reasons you just explained.
I also never do 80 on a road where there is anything but a near perfect surface, no traffic, and no intersections/stops.
3) I never drive at the limit of adhesion. I drive the same damn road day in and day out. If there is anything on the road, I dont go fast. There is one sweeping turn, awesome, it says 35. My car can probly take it @ 60. I do 45, and that is good enough for me.

4) There is reckless speeding, and then there is speeding you do when, given the best of your knowledge, there is relatively little risk.
Could a tire blow, could someone pull a hollywood style cartwheel over the median, wiping out multiple lanes of traffic-not likely, but it can happen.
I'm not saying speeding all the time, everywhere like a maniac is ok. I'm saying, in certain circumstances, it seems reasonable to me.
This is up to the driver, and conditions of the road.
It is not a standard, nor an on/off "speed/dont speed" sort of a caveat driver.
Students are not idiots, and it is...how should I say this-IDIOTIC to say students are idiots.
Personal disdain is not grounds for a generalization and classification.
Their desire to learn is proof enough they are not totally idiotic.
Perhaps a learned person such as yourself would use a more appropriate word, like sophomoric.
-Cm

Cm452 wrote:Students are not idiots, and it is...how should I say this-IDIOTIC to say students are idiots.
Personal disdain is not grounds for a generalization and classification.
Their desire to learn is proof enough they are not totally idiotic.
Perhaps a learned person such as yourself would use a more appropriate word, like sophomoric.
-Cm

One as learned as yourself should learn how to identify a joke.